Sleep in viertrek?

Arie baie goeie vraag .El sleep my karavaan met my Land Rover 110  300 tdi .Die van julle wat daai voertuig ken weet dat die stelsel so ontwerp is dat hy permanent 4x4 is .Met permanent 4x4 bedoel ek die voorwiele het 30% trek en die agter wiele 70% .Om die trek 50/50 te stel moet ek die kort hefboompie na lings beweeg om dit 50/50 te maak .Lae rat trekking moet ek die hefboompie na agter toe trek .Moet se dat ek gevind het om n karavaan in 4x4 te sleep maak die voertuig baie meer stabiel veral as daar n groot trok verby jou ry .Ek het geen kennis van die ander voertuie se 4x4 opsit nie ,het wel gelees van manne wat se hulle brandstof verbruik raak hoer as hulle permanent 4x4 ry op teerpad miskien is hier lede wat kennis het daarvan en dit graag hier wil deel

Ek het nog nooit die nodigheid daarin gesien om my wa  te sleep in 4X4 nie.  Maar dit wat oom Arie seg maak sin. Dit is wel so dat ek in reen weer na 4x4 oorskakel om die padhou vermoë te verbeter.

Sal ook nie skroom as die wa op n moeilike plek moet in gesleep word bv. teen n steil heling 4x4 laerstrek te gebruik nie juis om die kopelaer te beskerm.

My ou gertroue GWM is nie permanent in 4 wiel aandrywing nie.

Firstly, 4x4 is not actually 4x4, it is 1 driving wheel on each axle, actually = 2 x 4

In order for the front and rear axels to absorb different turning ratios there is a differential in the gearbox.

If both wheels on one axle are not turning, the differential will transfer power to that axle and you will be immobile <stuck>

If you then "lock up" the centre diff the gearbox will be forced to transfer power to both axels irrespective.

To accomodate for the different turning of each axles, on soft ground the differential "wind up"  exceed the force on the tyre and force a certain amount of slip... This is called gearbox wind-up, it is normal and the gearbox is designed to accomodate it.

If however, you are on hard surface and you lock up the centre diff, and drive for extended time, the tyre cannot slip, and you could cause severe damage to the gearbox

Perminent 4 x 4 means there is power to both axels but the diff will transfer the power to the axel that has the least traction.

You over ride that when you "go into" 4 x 4

On vehicles where you have free-wheel-hubs, the front side-shaft's are disengaged from the front wheels. You manually engage them and the above applies.

The old system of free wheel hubs is far more fuel efficient and much less wear and tear as there is nothing being constantly turned from the wheels through the front propshaft to the gearbox, but because it has to be manually engaged <do a little work> it has become the "in thing" to  keep all that stuff turning....

The above applies whether or not you do it electronically <push a button> or manually <engage diff lock>

So to answer the question: -

On soft surface it is good practice to tow with the cendre diff engaged

JUST DON'T FORGET TO DISENGAGE WHEN YOU GET TO HARD SURFACE <TAR>, AND NO NO NO NEVER DRIVE, MUCH LESS TOW IN 4 X 4 ON HARD SURFACE...

 Gotta go, I'll answer any questions tomorrow....

Interessante punt wat jy maak en vraag wat jy vra.  My Pathfinder is ook 4x4, maar ek het nog nooit daarin gesleep nie.  Jou stelling maak logies sin, maar ek sou graag wou hoor van kenners.  Ek moet sê my twee Pathfinders het gesamentlik 215 000km afgelê waarvan          66 000km met die Exclusive agterna en nog nooit het ek 'n ratkas, ewenaar of dryfas probleem ervaar nie.

Warren 100% explanation however the problem is when you lock up your diff locks on  on hard surfaces then both the wheels will turn the same revolutions  with no slip to compensate for ex when you take a corner .As you know our Landies have a extra diff in the transfer box to lock up to equal power to the front and rear diff . I have driven in high range centre diff lock towing my caravan with no side effects to my gearbox or transfer box

Wat sê die Landy se handleiding ?

Ek het ook n Defender County V8 gery.

So vêr ek kan onthou het hulle gesê jy moet nie senter Diff lock sluit as jy op n harde opervlakte ry nie. Maar nou is ek nie meer seker nie en het hom verkoop saam met sy handleiding.

Dit was 12 jaar terug.

Harde oppervlak kan misleidend wees....

Wat daarvan as mens oor n rotsbank moet gaan..... Ook mos n harde oppervlak

Hi guys it seems i have had it all wrong about my driving in 4x4 with the centre diff locked .The manual says for driving on tar the centre diff should never be engaged as it will cause damage to the transfer box /gearbox . Guess i was just lucky all these years by not damaging the gearbox although on my 90 tdi 300 the transfer box had to be reconditioned . Sorry for the misinformation

Arrie 100 % That's the point I make, and as per my post the reason why.

Dassie net so... And that's exactly why I needed to put it out there. When I had my Defender, I had particular problem. Although the indicator light displayed 4 x 4 the vehicle was actually NOT engaged..... <it was just so darn good I never realised it> Until I took it to Landy-on-line and they discovered the problem.

As it was, there was a problem with the linkages, and it was not actually pulling into 4 x 4 IE locking up the centre diff.... I still have the old linkages here in my office...

There is actually no way of actually KNOWING that the centre diff is locked, <you may very well ASSUME it's locked up by the dash light> unless you test it by jacking the front & back up and turning the wheels by hand to see what happens on the other axel..... THIS APPLIES TO ALL 4 X 4's <vir julle wat so die Landy's berispe>.

Giiven that you did drive with your centre diff locked seemingly up, on hard surface, perhaps you where not actually in 4 x 4, because I assure you, where that the case your gearbox would have been history....

Goes to show how capable Landrover's are..... even though their centre diff's are not loced up... they still go on as if they where... Hehehehe

For the un-informed, saying that it's OK to drive in 4 x 4 (Could be understood as OK to drive with the centre diff locked up),  The person with knowledge means there is power to both axels but the centre diff is not locked up.

I just want to stress, careful what you say, as to the un-informed it could spell disaster, and you need to lay the fact's out when it comes to this type of technical post.... Not everybody has the knowledge, and it could be mis-interperated..

Following my post from last night, It is however benificial to use both HIGH & LOW ranges when appropriate when towing. The different gear ratios do not affect whether the centre diff is or is not "locked-up".

For rough guessing, work on three times more power - strength and three times less speed between low & high ranges....

Low range is awfully useful when manovering ETC <you have far more control> whilst high range is used for normal towing...

So... in truth, a 2 x 4 is actually a 1 x 4 / a 4 x 4 is actually a 2 x 4 Unless you have a diff locks on one or more of the axels, like the Gelanderwagen (and Arrie's Pajero) which has both a front and rear axel locker.

Now to confuse the issue....

Many people do not understand that a "limited slip diff" is NOT the same as having a centre diff that's locked up....

Once in the Drakensberg, huge rainstorm, gravel road mountain pass.

Came to a big puddle of mud. I stopped assessed and decided on my approach stratatigy I locked up my centre diff and went through using aggressive speed to keep momentum.

Vehicle was a Dihatsu Rocky SE no locker on the rear axel like my Defender.

Then a Nissan Navara? came along and stopped and asked for my input. I asked was he 4 x 4 capable to which he answered yes....

Told him my strategy, and he applied it, only to enter the puddle and when it was very slippery spun round.

I winched him out, asked him was he in 4x4, to which he said I think so, it's a limited slip diff, isen't that also 4 x 4 ?

NOU JA!! Moerse big difference, the limited slip only kicked in AFTER traction was ALREADY  lost on the front axel, and his vehicle was being pushed in a circle by the back axel, then pulled in a circle by the (already too late) power on the front.

The locked up centre diff applies power to both axels immediately, creating a siultanous push - pull over both axels, thus keeping the vehicle straight.

In closing...... An off road vehicle is a very different animal to a sedan / SUV. Most fellas THINK they can and for the most part, do.....

The kak happens when it's not the same, and you pay very expensive and sometimes life-taking school fees.

Further... Once you unlock your centre diff, you may have to unwind the gearbox before it will dis-engage... Do this when you dis-engage by going into reverse for a short distance then go back into forward. If the indicator light does not go off repeat for a little further in reverse then go forwards... The indicator light should go out.

Put your bloody pride in your pocket AND GO TO SCHOOL / JOIN A CLUB AND LEARN!

Should be the same with towing a van.......

Hope this helps..... Sorry it's long-winded.... just punch through....

SEDGE

Going over rocks ETC, there is sufficient opportunity for the wheels to slip, as the contact between the rocks and tyre reduces over sharp points, rocks & stones move to create slippage and so on

DASSIE

You are right. But I did not wat to further complicate an alreay complicated discussion. A diff lock on the axel (either front or rear axel, does exactly that, A locker will, on THE SAME AXEL.... IE not front to rear axel) prevent the diff from transferring power to the wheel that has no traction. It will divide the power equally between left and right wheels ON THE SAME AXEL...

That's why a Gelanderwagen & Arries Pajero are such awsome off road vehicles.... You can lock up the power between axels and lock up the power between left and right wheels on both axels.... true 4x4...

But then you can't turn.... You gotta lign up your attack, lock up, low range and go....

My defender had an ARB locker on the rear axel...

Baie dankie Warren!   Ek het alles gelees en het die meeste verstaan, vir iemand wat nog nooit 'n fo by fo of  4 x 4 gehad het nie  

Going over rocks ETC, there is sufficient opportunity for the wheels to slip, as the contact between the rocks and tyre reduces over sharp points, rocks & stones move to create slippage and so on

Warren ek het die stelling juis gemaak vir die mense wat dink as ek oor n harde rotsbank in 4X4 kan ry sal die teerpad nie skade doen nie.. 

 Yip 100 %

I also totally agree with the philosophy of slow....

Slow & go...... Fast & Fuc%p

And that's why I do not advocate a snatch type of recovery....

I'd rather winch and slow than snatch & go.... Because when it goes wrong it goesvery very wrong and with such speed & force you have no control whatsoever...

When you BEGIN to get stuck you are already beyond the capability of the vehicle...

(Define vehicle as driver / tyres / engine / include everything)....

A good vehicle does not get stuck.... The driver knows when to or when not to....

But, when you are beyond the capability of the vehicle, inclusive of all of the above... Best you stop & sort it out at a pace you can control...

Bear in mind as well... YOU might be capable, with correctly mounted recovery attachments...... and.......... and......... and.......... You might be capable & knowledgable, but whoever is recovering you / or you are recovering might not be, and the results could be just as catastrophic....

Guys, you are playing with stuff that can kill....

BTW..... There is NO un-neccessary advice...... Sombody who does not know might just save himself a hellava wack...

Daar is ook n klomp mense wat dink dat dit goed lyk om al die katoeters op die voertuig te hê maar het geen benul van hoe en waar en wanneer dit gebruik word nie. Dan raak dit baie gevaarlik vir daardie persoon om off road te gaan.  Nie eers te praat van die BRAAIVLEIS OFF ROADERS nie.

Ek is self ook glad nie n voorstander van die SNATCH STRAP ding nie.